stops charging

Discussion about the MX60 Charge Controller

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jitterz
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Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

stops charging

Post by jitterz »

I bought an off grid property. Solar pv, 24v battery bank with a propane backup generator. The solar array charges my batteries up to 29.7v then starts float mode. When power is low I switch on the generator and it brings up power to 24.8v and will not increase past no matter how long it runs. Is this a setting on the outback60 charge controller that I need to adjust? I'm very new to all this, any help is appreciated.
raysun
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My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01 - Series Stacked, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
6 SimpliPhi 3.8-48 (48v @ 75AH. 450AH total)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
2 Midnite Solar MNPV6 combiners w/20A DC disconnects.
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator
Off-Grid

Re: stops charging

Post by raysun »

As noted, there are two chargers:
• The Outback solar charge controller. MX60 is an old model, FlexMax 60 (FM60) is the current model. This controller takes DC from the solar panels and converts it to charging current and voltages required by the battery.
• The generator / inverter charger. Certain inverter models have built-in battery charging circuits. The inverter accepts AC Input (from the generator in this case) and converts it DC charging current and voltages required by the battery.
Both chargers work independently. For them to both maintain the battery, they should be properly programmed.
If you would like more help in configuring the devices, list the equipment in detail in your profile: Exact charge controller model (MX60 or FM60), inverter model, battery model and configuration, generator model, solar panel model.
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

Ok, I didn't realize the generator went through the inverter to the batteries. I believe the charge controller is an flexmax60. The generator is a Cummins 13kw propane. The inverter is an AIMS 24v inverter charger, I don't know the actual model but I believe it's the one on this link
https://www.aimscorp.net/product/2000-w ... r-24-volt/
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SandyP
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Location: Victoria, Australia

Re: stops charging

Post by SandyP »

jitterz wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:36 am I bought an off grid property. Solar pv, 24v battery bank with a propane backup generator. The solar array charges my batteries up to 29.7v then starts float mode. When power is low I switch on the generator and it brings up power to 24.8v and will not increase past no matter how long it runs. Is this a setting on the outback60 charge controller that I need to adjust? I'm very new to all this, any help is appreciated.
Lets us know exactly what model inverter/charger you have.
Looking at the instruction manual for the Aims Inverters I suspect that on your system the battery charging function may not enabled or if it is the charging "rate" is set very low.
-------------------------
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raysun
Forum Overlord
Posts: 10753
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01 - Series Stacked, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
6 SimpliPhi 3.8-48 (48v @ 75AH. 450AH total)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
2 Midnite Solar MNPV6 combiners w/20A DC disconnects.
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator
Off-Grid

Re: stops charging

Post by raysun »

jitterz wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 1:35 pm Ok, I didn't realize the generator went through the inverter to the batteries. I believe the charge controller is an flexmax60. The generator is a Cummins 13kw propane. The inverter is an AIMS 24v inverter charger, I don't know the actual model but I believe it's the one on this link
https://www.aimscorp.net/product/2000-w ... r-24-volt/
What type/brand/model battery is being used?
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

8 x Discover L16 - 6 Volt AGM 400ah batteries
They're wired into a 24v system. I'm going to the property tomorrow and will get you the exact controller model and photos. Thanks for everyone's help so far.
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

The inverter model number is aims 24v
PICOGLF30W24V120VS
The dip switches are set
Sw1 = 1
SW2 = 1
SW3 = 0
Sw4 is 0
Battery selector is set at 2
Charge current control is max
I run the generator for 2 hrs. It hits 24.8w quickly and then won't move for over an hour. Once I shut it down the batteries drop to 23.9w.

Hope that makes sense to you.
Last edited by jitterz on Fri Sep 29, 2023 6:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

Just noticed there's an sw4 switch
Sw4 is 0
raysun
Forum Overlord
Posts: 10753
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01 - Series Stacked, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
6 SimpliPhi 3.8-48 (48v @ 75AH. 450AH total)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
2 Midnite Solar MNPV6 combiners w/20A DC disconnects.
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator
Off-Grid

Re: stops charging

Post by raysun »

The AIMS manual has a table showing the charging voltages for the different battery types that can be selected. Battery Type 7 is Lithium with a charge voltage: 28.8V.
Screenshot_20230929_152246_Drive.jpg
raysun
Forum Overlord
Posts: 10753
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01 - Series Stacked, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
6 SimpliPhi 3.8-48 (48v @ 75AH. 450AH total)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
2 Midnite Solar MNPV6 combiners w/20A DC disconnects.
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator
Off-Grid

Re: stops charging

Post by raysun »

jitterz wrote: Fri Sep 29, 2023 6:19 pm Just noticed there's an sw4 switch
Sw4 is 0
Screenshot_20230929_152639_Drive.jpg
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

raysun wrote: Fri Sep 29, 2023 6:21 pm The AIMS manual has a table showing the charging voltages for the different battery types that can be selected. Battery Type 7 is Lithium with a charge voltage: 28.8V.

Screenshot_20230929_152246_Drive.jpg
My batteries are AGM's. It should be type 2. Correct??
raysun
Forum Overlord
Posts: 10753
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01 - Series Stacked, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
6 SimpliPhi 3.8-48 (48v @ 75AH. 450AH total)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
2 Midnite Solar MNPV6 combiners w/20A DC disconnects.
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator
Off-Grid

Re: stops charging

Post by raysun »

jitterz wrote: Fri Sep 29, 2023 6:38 pm
raysun wrote: Fri Sep 29, 2023 6:21 pm The AIMS manual has a table showing the charging voltages for the different battery types that can be selected. Battery Type 7 is Lithium with a charge voltage: 28.8V.

Screenshot_20230929_152246_Drive.jpg
My batteries are AGM's. It should be type 2. Correct??
Yes, sorry my mistake. What is the Absorb voltage specified for the battery model?
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

I'm new at all this, and don't really understand the replies. I'm starting to think my batteries have sulphated. I certainly hope not, they're only 2 years old. Has anyone used the desulphate setting on their inverter? My inverter has the option but I've heard it's not recommended.
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

Yes, sorry my mistake. What is the Absorb voltage specified for the battery model?
[/quote]

I don't understand what your asking. Right now I'm sitting at 24.2v in the batteries, the pv is showing 24.7A coming in but the batteries are constant. They should be raising steadily.
raysun
Forum Overlord
Posts: 10753
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01 - Series Stacked, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
6 SimpliPhi 3.8-48 (48v @ 75AH. 450AH total)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
2 Midnite Solar MNPV6 combiners w/20A DC disconnects.
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator
Off-Grid

Re: stops charging

Post by raysun »

What is the specific battery model?
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

raysun wrote: Sat Sep 30, 2023 9:42 am What is the specific battery model?
Batteries are Discover L16 - 6 Volt AGM 400ah
raysun
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Posts: 10753
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01 - Series Stacked, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
6 SimpliPhi 3.8-48 (48v @ 75AH. 450AH total)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
2 Midnite Solar MNPV6 combiners w/20A DC disconnects.
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator
Off-Grid

Re: stops charging

Post by raysun »

Screenshot_20230930_073751_Chrome.jpg
Discover makes several lines of batteries, all with potentially different charging parameters.
L16 describes a case dimension. 400AH (hopefully) 20 Hour discharge capacity. I'll assume it's the battery above: 6VRE-2700FD. This from their line of home solar deep cycle "dry cell" AGM batteries.
If that's the battery block, here's the manual:
https://assets.discoverbattery.com/docu ... manual.pdf

For Bulk Charging (the initial charging stage), AES recommends a charge current between 10% and 25% of C20 battery capacity. For the 800AH battery: 80A - 200A of charge current.
At absolute maximum, the solar charger can provide 60A, likely much less on average. It would take a long time for the solar setup to put significant charge on the battery. During Bulk, the battery voltage would change slowly.
The 2nd charging phase is called "Absorb", and is a Constant Voltage charging profile. The Absorb Voltage for this battery is listed at 28.8V. That is the voltage to which the battery should be held while Absorb Charging. The charge current will start out high, but decline over time as the battery "fills".
Another important note. AGM batteries are sensitive to overcharging. As the battery internal temperature increases (due in part to ambient temperature) the charge voltage should be adjusted downward. Likewise, to avoid undercharging, as temperature decreases, charge voltage should be adjusted upward. Temperature Compensated Charging is possible with the FlexMax and AIMS by adding their Remote Temperature Sensors.
It was mentioned that the FlexMax is charging the battery to 29.7V (in Absorb). If the battery listed in this reply is being used, the Absorb Voltage should be 28.8V
To achieve 28.8V with the AIMS, battery selection #4 (Sealed Lead Acid) seems to be the best choice.
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

Seems to be similar style of battery. I found the link to the actual model I have

https://discoverbattery.com/products/search/evl16a-a-am

I'm out right now but will try setting the inverter to #4 and give it a try.

Thanks, hopefully this works.
raysun
Forum Overlord
Posts: 10753
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01 - Series Stacked, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
6 SimpliPhi 3.8-48 (48v @ 75AH. 450AH total)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
2 Midnite Solar MNPV6 combiners w/20A DC disconnects.
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator
Off-Grid

Re: stops charging

Post by raysun »

jitterz wrote: Sat Sep 30, 2023 12:12 pm Seems to be similar style of battery. I found the link to the actual model I have

https://discoverbattery.com/products/search/evl16a-a-am

I'm out right now but will try setting the inverter to #4 and give it a try.

Thanks, hopefully this works.
For this battery model, the Absorb Voltage is specified as 2.45V per cell, so 2.45 × 12 = 29.4V.
It sounds like the FlexMax is reasonably close to the target.
The AIMS profile that comes closest at 29.2V is actually labeled "AGM2" (#3).
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

:lol: OK #3 it is. Hopefully I haven't totally screwed my batteries.

Again thanks for your help
raysun
Forum Overlord
Posts: 10753
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01 - Series Stacked, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
6 SimpliPhi 3.8-48 (48v @ 75AH. 450AH total)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
2 Midnite Solar MNPV6 combiners w/20A DC disconnects.
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator
Off-Grid

Re: stops charging

Post by raysun »

Are Remote Temperature Sensor cables attached to the FlexMax and AIMS, and attached to the battery?
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

raysun wrote: Sat Sep 30, 2023 12:46 pm Are Remote Temperature Sensor cables attached to the FlexMax and AIMS, and attached to the battery?
I don't know what I'dbe looking for. I don't think so. There are 2 thick cables from the aims to the batteries and there are 4 cables from the flexmax to the batteries. Nothing stands out to me as a sensor wire.
I've emailed a solar technician to come check it out. I think I'm way over my head here.
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

I did try battery selector number 3. Didn't seem to make any difference.
raysun
Forum Overlord
Posts: 10753
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01 - Series Stacked, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
6 SimpliPhi 3.8-48 (48v @ 75AH. 450AH total)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
2 Midnite Solar MNPV6 combiners w/20A DC disconnects.
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator
Off-Grid

Re: stops charging

Post by raysun »

The temperature sensors are important, but are not central to the charging issue you're experiencing. You may ignore temperature compensation for now.
It was mentioned that the system came with the property. How old is the battery?
jitterz
Forum Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:10 am
My RE system: 6 x 250w LDK panels
Outback flexmax60 CC
Aims 24V inverter
8x6v discovery batteries 400ah
24v 800ah battery bank

Re: stops charging

Post by jitterz »

raysun wrote: Sat Sep 30, 2023 6:30 pm The temperature sensors are important, but are not central to the charging issue you're experiencing. You may ignore temperature compensation for now.
It was mentioned that the system came with the property. How old is the battery?
I just bought them in 2021. The system was already in but the previous batteries were dead.
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