Radian does not make solar power until afternoon

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Pontiacta77
Forum Junior Member
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:13 pm
My RE system: 1 flexnet
1fndc
1 mate 3s
1 outbackradian gs8048a
Ouback loadcenter
2FM 80 charge controlees
1 lead acid battery back 760 amp hours at 20hr rate
7860 watt array

Radian does not make solar power until afternoon

Post by Pontiacta77 »

Okay hi my name is rob and i have a solar system. I had a company instal panels and the inverter and shortly after they went out of business so i am trying to get my system to work. Recently the main stack, 1 module, the mate3s, fndc and hub all blew. Do not know what happened. I replaced all that, still waiting on a new inverter module, so i have it set to only run on the working one. My system will not start making solar production until i reset the pv (green breaker) a few times. I know this is some kind of settings issue. It will make power aftee fidling. I have gone through this and the settings quite a few times. I do not know what to set things to. My system is as follows
radian 8048
2 fm80 charge controlers
Fndc
Flexnet dc
Hub
7680 array with east and west facing panels
760 amp hour lead acid battery bank
Load center
It is grid tied, and set to such
I have battery specs, manuals etc. I have watched many hours of utube videos and stepped through those
I hired a local person to look at it, no dice.
I have no errors or warnings, system says ok,
I no longer know what to do. Any help appreciated. Thank you for your time.
raysun
Forum Emperor
Posts: 5627
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
SimpliPhi 48-3.8 (6 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Radian does not make solar power until afternoon

Post by raysun »

Recently the main stack, 1 module, the mate3s, fndc and hub all blew. Do not know what happened. I replaced all that, still waiting on a new inverter module, so i have it set to only run on the working one.
Yikes! Sorry to hear about the unfortunate experience with the vendor/installer, and even more unfortunate experience with the equipment failures.

Since the failure caused such substantial damage, I'd advise being very cautious about reactivating the system until the cause is known and preventative measures are in place to reduce the probability of it reoccuring.

The green disconnect (circuit breaker) is likely a Ground Fault Detector - Interrupter. If it continues to trip, there is either a ground fault in the solar array, or the unit itself is damaged.

Being grid tied adds another layer of complexity to the system.

I urge you to find a local electrician or solar installer who is knowledgeable about Outback systems, and have them help put this system in good working order.

Good luck!
Pontiacta77
Forum Junior Member
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:13 pm
My RE system: 1 flexnet
1fndc
1 mate 3s
1 outbackradian gs8048a
Ouback loadcenter
2FM 80 charge controlees
1 lead acid battery back 760 amp hours at 20hr rate
7860 watt array

Re: Radian does not make solar power until afternoon

Post by Pontiacta77 »

Ha, i tried that i am out a few hundred dollars by going that route. The bad inverter module was most likely the cause of the failures. I have checked for a circular ground, and stray current. I believe its start time is based on some kind of setting, sleeping to long, absorb time wrong? Or float?
raysun
Forum Emperor
Posts: 5627
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
SimpliPhi 48-3.8 (6 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Radian does not make solar power until afternoon

Post by raysun »

There are several posts on this forum about Radian inverter modules failing for various reasons, but I can't recall one where other equipment was also damaged in the process. I can't say its never happened, but can say its a very serious development. There's no way, not seeing the system, that a reasonable diagnosis can be made, and by your own admission no cause has been identified. TBH, that's more than a bit concerning, but moving along...

The GFDI disconnect (Green circuit breaker) disconnects the battery from the FM80 charge controllers in a ground fault event, or in an over-current event (greater than 80A from either FM80). Its definitely meant as an "emergency disconnect". Switching it off with the solar panels connected to the FM80s can damage the charge controllers. If needing to reset them by power cycling, be sure to disconnect the PV Arrays first.

As far as settings impacting charging behavior, I can't think of any battery charging parameter that would do as described. The usual function of the FM charge controllers is to "wake up" after sunrise, when sufficient light has caused the panels to start producing, and enter the Bulk charging phase. Bulk continues until the Absorb voltage has been reached, then the Absorb phase executes, generally until the Absorb Time has elapsed. The charge controllers then go silent until the Float Voltage is reached, then they enter the Float stage until the sun goes down.

What are the following settings on the FM80s:
Absorb Voltage
Absorb Time
Float Voltage

Another parameter to check:
Wake Up Voltage

The wake up voltage keeps the controllers from starting too soon after sunrise, when the panels may be producing a voltage as V(oc), but no current. Wake Up Voltage is the amount the panel array voltage must rise from its starting voltage in order for the FM80s to turn on. The default is 6V.

With the system grid tied, another (remote) possibility may be the grid settings are charging the battery with the inverter charger before the charge controllers wake up, and when the FM80s do start charging, find the battery voltage above the Absorb Voltage, so shut down because they have nothing to do. Later in the day, grid input is removed and solar charging may be able to start. The above is pure speculation. One way to prove/disprove this would be to drop the grid in the morning when the charge controllers should be charging.
fcwlp
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Posts: 877
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My RE system: GS8048A, FM80 w/3,600W PV Fixed, FM80 w/2,700W on Zomeworks tracker, Mate3, 24 Trojan 2V L16 1100AH @ C20, Grid-Tied with Kohler 14RESA LPG Generator and MEP-803 Diesel if needed.

I install and maintain grid-tied and off-grid systems in my area and consult on solar system design/operation.
Location: 80 miles NE of Phoenix at 5500'

Re: Radian does not make solar power until afternoon

Post by fcwlp »

On your Mate3s, go to (if on OpticsRE) Global Charge tab and make sure "Auto Grid-Tie Control" is disabled.

As @raysun stated flipping the green breaker is not good. To correctly power down your two FM80s, open the two PV input breakers and then open the green breaker which is a ground fault breaker on the battery side of the FM80s. To correctly power up, close the green breaker first and then close the two PV input breakers.

Taking out the Mate3s, FNDC and Hub would require a significant over voltage event. It appears the inverter module failure caused this but that requres some failure analysis that is beyond the scope of a forum.
Pontiacta77
Forum Junior Member
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:13 pm
My RE system: 1 flexnet
1fndc
1 mate 3s
1 outbackradian gs8048a
Ouback loadcenter
2FM 80 charge controlees
1 lead acid battery back 760 amp hours at 20hr rate
7860 watt array

Re: Radian does not make solar power until afternoon

Post by Pontiacta77 »

Thank you to both replies, i will verify based on your explanations. I do believe my wske up voltage is 6v. My float is 56.4 per manufsctures instructions, it also says bulk and rebulk are same voltage. In the mate i can not make them all the same.
raysun
Forum Emperor
Posts: 5627
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A-01, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
SimpliPhi 48-3.8 (6 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Radian does not make solar power until afternoon

Post by raysun »

also says bulk and rebulk are same voltage. In the mate i can not make them all the same.
Many manuals refer to Bulk Voltage. It is what Outback refers to as Absorb Voltage.

Rebulk Voltage is the battery voltage at which a new Bulk charge cycle would be initiated. (It also serves other logic.) On my experience, the Rebulk Voltage should be set to a point about 60-70% State of Charge while under load. The default is 48V. Rebulk may need to be adjusted from that point, depending on load characteristics of the system.
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