Using my excess solar FX2024

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raysun
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Posts: 4540
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
SimpliPhi 48-3.8 (6 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Using my excess solar FX2024

Post by raysun »

SandyP wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:11 am
culmore wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 1:14 am When electricity flows back to the store room and cottages from the FXR will it not also flow back to kenya Power? How do I stop that?
I assumed on all grid connected outback systems (depending on settings) the solar power output from the charge controllers was "use it or lose it"
So it either goes to loads and/or to charging the battery or is "lost" to the grid or "lost" when the charge controller(s) decrease their output as there is no "demand" for their output.
It would appear "grid connected" and "grid tied" have two distinct characteristics.

Most any Outback inverter can be "grid connected" by wiring the grid to AC IN. What the inverter can do with that current is quite different depending on the modes it supports.

The FX (excluding GFX) inverters can use the grid current to feed AC OUT, and for charging. That's it.

GFX was the first, and fussiest, implementation of "Grid Interactive" functionality.

The Radian and FXR inverters support many of the same modes. The most germain to the post is "Grid Tied". This mode allows excess PV power to be "sold" back to the grid, via AC IN.

As a consequence, "selling to the grid" makes AC current available for consumption by any load between the inverter AC IN and the main load panel.
raysun
Forum Emperor
Posts: 4540
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
SimpliPhi 48-3.8 (6 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Using my excess solar FX2024

Post by raysun »

fcwlp wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:51 pm
raysun wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:43 am Scenarios 2 and 3 only apply to FXR class inverters. The FX class is not grid interactive.
But the picture showed a Radian. :grin: I know the GVFX is grid-interactive and my FX manual says it is can sell. I have not worked on grid-tied FX, so can not confirm.
raysun wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:43 am
In the 2nd scenario ("grid-tied") - the connection would require power company approval. The "selling to the grid" can power loads on the "main" panel. If the amount of current being "sold" is less than the main panel loads consume, there would be no current flowing to the meter.
But that would require ability to sense the current and control the output of the inverter. The FXR and Radian can not do this, not sure about the Skybox but I don't recall that capability.
GFX aside, no FX supports Grid Tie. Radian and FXR inverters do support "Grid Interactive" functions, one of which is Grid Tie, where the inverter can "Sell to the Grid".

In order to minimize the possibility of actually pushing current to the grid, the Grid Sell Current Limit can be set low enough that "upstream" loads consume the power. I do not believe there is a dynamic adjustment, just the static setting.

Gawd, I'm glad I'm off-grid. 😂
raysun
Forum Emperor
Posts: 4540
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
SimpliPhi 48-3.8 (6 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
REC Alpha 440W panels - 2 arrays: each of 4 strings of 2 in series
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Using my excess solar FX2024

Post by raysun »

culmore wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:35 pm
fcwlp wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:51 pm
raysun wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:43 am Scenarios 2 and 3 only apply to FXR class inverters. The FX class is not grid interactive.
But the picture showed a Radian. :grin: I know the GVFX is grid-interactive and my FX manual says it is can sell. I have not worked on grid-tied FX, so can not confirm.
raysun wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:43 am
In the 2nd scenario ("grid-tied") - the connection would require power company approval. The "selling to the grid" can power loads on the "main" panel. If the amount of current being "sold" is less than the main panel loads consume, there would be no current flowing to the meter.
But that would require ability to sense the current and control the output of the inverter. The FXR and Radian can not do this, not sure about the Skybox but I don't recall that capability.
I don’t mind selling the fx2024 and buying a new inverter.

Kenya power will likely not allow me to sell to them. So whatever goes to the grid is wasted.
Waste not, want not.

Proper setting will keep current from the inverter from reaching the grid.

My 'anti-establishment" nature would be happy were I grid tied and not on a power-selling agreement, to simply run the meter backward with the excess power and enjoy a lower power bill. 😉
culmore
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Re: Using my excess solar FX2024

Post by culmore »

the two solutions

1) Kenya power requires a device to be fitted before the main meter to block the flow of current back to the grid. so the idea of putting a FXR in my main house and "selling" should benefit the cottages. (but Im a computer programer not an electrical engineer.) btw there is a sell option on my mate mate menus, I suppose it works??? Have not tried it.

2) The other solution of having the FX feed the cottages seems like rock solid design ( but Im a computer programer not an electrical engineer.) Can the FX series 2000 limit the amount of current it takes from the batteries and switch to the mains above say 1KW?? or do I need a new inverter for that???? I cannot find this limit on the mate menus. I have an original mate model.

Thanks so much folks. These boards are a great resource. /bow

PS My outback equipment has been installed for ten years without a single problem and let me tell you in kenya everything breaks!!!! :grin: I dunno why it just does. Well okay I had a direct lightening strike but nothing Outback can do about that. Unless you guys have a channel to the boss man.
Mike Curran
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My RE system: Outback - Garage roof:
- 8 (2x4) Evergreen 180's into one FM80 (2007/2020 - replaced MX60)
- 6 (2×3) ALEO S79-300's into one FM80 (2017)
- 2 grid-tied VFXR3524A-01's series stacked, replaced GVFX's (2020)
- 12 Surrette/Rolls 2V x 1766Ah (2007)
- Hub10.3, Mate3s, FNDC, RTS. Tigo ES maximizers on each PV module.

Westinghouse Solar - Barn roof: (2012)
- 30 (2x15) 235W panels with Enphase M215 microinverters, grid-tied

Outback Skybox - Barn roof: (2019)
- 14 Talesun 275W in series (DC array input to SB inverter/charger)
- 3 SimpliPhi 3.8 batteries, 48V, 225Ah total
- AC coupled input from 14 Talesun 275W, Enphase M215 microinverters

All self-designed and self-installed
Location: Chagrin Falls, Ohio

Re: Using my excess solar FX2024

Post by Mike Curran »

Can the FX series 2000 limit the amount of current it takes from the batteries and switch to the mains above say 1KW?? 
Your HBX function sorta does that by sensing when battery voltage goes below your preset low threshold and switches to grid supply, if I understand HBX operation correctly...
https://smart.tigoenergy.com/p/pZXn7SZQyO45?date=2021-04-19
https://enlighten.enphaseenergy.com/public/systems/Hctc107221
culmore
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Re: Using my excess solar FX2024

Post by culmore »

Mike Curran wrote: Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:15 am
Can the FX series 2000 limit the amount of current it takes from the batteries and switch to the mains above say 1KW?? 
Your HBX function sorta does that by sensing when battery voltage goes below your preset low threshold and switches to grid supply, if I understand HBX operation correctly...
Yes almost. My batteries are comfortable at 531 watts, they will run for 7.5 hours and go from 100% to 50%... thats okay for the evening. Charging the next day is not really a problem in kenya.

But at 2kwh I get 1 hour of usage and the batteries will go from 100 % to 50%. Yikes thats not okay!!!!!
provo
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My RE system: Sixteen Evergreen EC-120
(4 strings, total 1920W)
Eight Rolls S-550 (2 strings, total ~800Ah @ 24V)
One FM80
One VFXR3524A
Hub 10
Mate3s
FNDC and Trimetric
Honda EU3000is generator
Location: Sierra foothills

Re: Using my excess solar FX2024

Post by provo »

culmore wrote: Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:10 am
Can the FX series 2000 limit the amount of current it takes from the batteries and switch to the mains above say 1KW?
That would be Load Grid Transfer rather than HBX. I don't know about your inverter model, but it's a Mate function, so poke around in the Mate and see if it's there. Should be in the same menu as HBX.
culmore
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Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:34 am

Re: Using my excess solar FX2024

Post by culmore »

provo wrote: Thu Nov 26, 2020 6:39 am
That would be Load Grid Transfer rather than HBX. I don't know about your inverter model, but it's a Mate function, so poke around in the Mate and see if it's there. Should be in the same menu as HBX.
Thanks Provo. Cant see it under hbx on the mate menus. Hmmm maybe if I upgraded firmware. How do you upgrade firmware on these first gen mates.
Send the chip back to the dealer?
provo
Forum Czar
Posts: 718
Joined: Thu Jul 27, 2006 4:34 pm
My RE system: Sixteen Evergreen EC-120
(4 strings, total 1920W)
Eight Rolls S-550 (2 strings, total ~800Ah @ 24V)
One FM80
One VFXR3524A
Hub 10
Mate3s
FNDC and Trimetric
Honda EU3000is generator
Location: Sierra foothills

Re: Using my excess solar FX2024

Post by provo »

culmore wrote: Thu Nov 26, 2020 6:47 am
Cant see it under hbx on the mate menus.
Sorry -- I checked my old Mate/Mate2 Manual (2005!) and HBX is there but not LGX.
That must have come later :cry:

Next time you have some mad money lying around, you might pick up a newer inverter and a Mate3s :grin: !
culmore
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Posts: 29
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:34 am

Re: Using my excess solar FX2024

Post by culmore »

provo wrote: Thu Nov 26, 2020 8:06 am
culmore wrote: Thu Nov 26, 2020 6:47 am
Cant see it under hbx on the mate menus.
Sorry -- I checked my old Mate/Mate2 Manual (2005!) and HBX is there but not LGX.
That must have come later :cry:

Next time you have some mad money lying around, you might pick up a newer inverter and a Mate3s :grin: !
Thanks


That will be a fine day! I want a Tesla power wall also (or equivalent )!!!!!!
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